Two Spanish Tripoints
Two Spanish Tripoints - 2005-09-11 - updated 2006-05-14
by Hugh Wallis
Text and all photographs © 2005, 2006, Hugh Wallis - All Rights Reserved
La Rioja, Castilla-León and Navarra
Following a posting on Yahoo Groups borderpoint mailing list enquiring about
a Spanish Provincial tripoint I decided to give it a visit on my trip through
Spain. Looking at the map I noticed that there were actually two tripoints
within a few km of each other making the potential rewards of taking this
diversion that much greater. What follows is my findings - note that all the
photos are presented on this page in thumbnail format - clicking on them will
bring up the full photo, which is generally around 700KB (so be warned). All GPS
waypoint information is using the WGS84 datum.
The original enquiry referenced a website entitled
HISTORIA DE LOS
TRES REYES (History of the Three Kings) and a
detailed map.
This was the tripoint between the Spanish Provinces of Navarra, La Rioja
and Aragón (note that the name differences on the marker are explained in the
"History of the Three Kings" article - click
here for a Babelfish translation into English) and on or
near the N-113 highway. The aforementioned map showed the tripoint as being
northwest of the road. Looking at other maps, Microsoft Streets and Trips showed
it as being southeast of the road as did another topographical map I located.
When I reached the appropriate spot on the road I searched around for any
kind of marker some distance either side of the road but was unable to locate
one. What I did locate was all on the road itself. From these conflicting pieces
of evidence it is is not possible, therefore, to determine accurately exactly
where the tripoint is located. The
following photographs hopefully will provide some interest, at any rate..
|
Microsoft Streets and Trips Map - click for full size |
|
View looking southwest with the two road signs visible. The
tripoint marker is on the far side, on the bank of the road between the
nearest two white road marking posts. |
|
View to the northeast from behind the tripoint marker. The
marker itself is located at N42° 00.437' W001° 50.790', elevation 1,801 ft.
- note that is says "Logrono" not "La Rioja" - the old name
for the province as explained in the article. |
|
Side 1 of the tripoint marker - La Rioja, Zaragoza |
|
Side 2 of the tripoint marker - Zaragoza, Navarra |
|
I did not get a photo of both Navarra and La Roija sides in
the same picture |
|
Closer view of the tripoint marker and road. The road
surface changes south of the municipal signs and north of the tripoint
marker. The road surface change is at N42° 00.448' W001° 50.773', elevation
1,808 ft |
Update 2006-05-14
The following is part of the text of an e-mail I sent to the boundarypoint
mailing list in December 2005 about some further research I did on these two tripoints, which
contains links to various supporting material.
Revisiting these two Spanish tripoints from the comfort of my computer and the
internet I have a lot more information to share now. Regrettably this means
that I am now convinced that NEITHER of my two "finds" last September were
actually of tripoints. :(
I
have found the following evidence that makes it quite clear that the actual
tripoint is, indeed, some distance to the north west of the road where I had
stopped and taken the pictures that are at
http://tinyurl.com/baglc, including ones of the supposed tripoint "mojón"
which is obviously in the wrong place.
First I have found various topographical maps published by various agencies as
follows:
Now I have also found a wonderful site from the Spanish Ministry of
Agriculture that has very detailed land division information superimposed on
aerial photographs - this is at
http://www.mapa.es/es/sig/pags/sigpac/intro.htm#inicio and leads you to
various sites for each of the autonomous communities in Spain, some of which
have better information than others.
First looking at the info from Navarra (http://sigpac.tracasa.es/navegar/)
we can see in http://tinyurl.com/c8w8y
the boundary of Navarra superimposed on a photo from 2003. In
http://tinyurl.com/7zvv6 we have the
same information on a photo from earlier (interesting to note the change in
vegetation around the area of the tripoint during this interim period). It is
also very interesting to note that the boundaries do not appear to be as
straight as marked on the topo maps but tend to jog around quite a lot.
However, adding in the info from La Rioja (http://sigpac.larioja.org/visor/)
in picture http://tinyurl.com/7tuxr
things get a bit confusing because if you now compare all three images you see
that the little triangle shown on the Aragón picture crossing the railway
overlaps with the land apparently claimed by Navarra thus raising the
possibility that the actual tripoint is just south of the railway.
So another visit is most definitely called for - I hope to get back there in
early May next year when I have another possible visit to Spain in the works.
So I did indeed have the opportunity to revisit the location on 2006-05-14
while driving from the north coast of Spain to Madrid. I went to where I now
expected to find the real tripoint and, indeed, there was a marker there. Some
photos now follow.
|
The tripoint marker - this is the only face with any
inscription on it. |
|
Two of the other faces of the marker. |
|
The fourth face is visible here. |
|
View of the marker and its environs, facing north. The
abandoned railway line is to the right of the marker. |
|
View of the marker and its environs, facing south. The
abandoned railway line is to the left of the marker. |
|
The "money shot" - Class "A" find. |
La Rioja, Castilla-León and Aragón
Then I moved on further south where the map showed a tripoint right on the
road between La Rioja, Castilla-León and Aragón
|
Microsoft Streets and Trips Map - click for full size -
Aragón is on the east side, Castilla-León on the south and La Rioja on the
northwest. |
|
Looking south from behind the tripoint marker which is
located at N41° 57.934' W001° 51.483', elevation 2,017 ft. |
|
Close up of the "Soria" (i.e. Castilla-León) side of the
tripoint marker - we are facing south here, i.e. TOWARDS the named
province |
|
Close up of the "Logrono" (i.e. La Rioja) side of the
tripoint marker - we are facing northwest here i.e. TOWARDS the named
province |
|
Close up of the third side which should be the Aragón (Zaragoza)
- except that the writing is completely worn away. Also note that we are
looking west - i.e. AWAY from the (supposedly) named province - so someone
messed up when they built this marker!! There is no way to place it
correctly so that the sides consistently face either towards or away from
the named provinces (unless you turn it upside down!!) |
|
A general view looking back northwards to show where the
road surface changes. The marker is just in front of my car, behind the
barrier. |
|
General view along the line of where the La Rioja/Castilla-León
border lies. The signs say "Private Hunting Land" and I could hear the sound
of gunshots so I decided NOT to go wandering. |
Update 2006-05-14
The following is part of the text of an e-mail I sent to the boundarypoint
mailing list in December 2005 about some further research I did on these two tripoints, which
contains links to various supporting material.
Now - turning our attention a few km down the road to es2arcllo (Aragón,
Castilla-León, La Rioja) which I had thought I had found at the roadside:
Looking at topo map
http://tinyurl.com/brcqh (1:50000) it appears that the tripoint is not by
the roadside at all but some distance to the east. This would explain the fact
that there were only two readable province names on the marker I found at the
roadside and why they were apparently inconsistently placed for marking a
tripoint (I was led astray by the fact that this was a triangular cross
section marker)
To confirm this lets look at some aerial photos:
http://tinyurl.com/caqdw is from La
Rioja (unfortunately there is no actual photo at the probable tripoint
although boundaries are shown) and
http://tinyurl.com/7zys7 is from Aragón and
http://tinyurl.com/933th from
Castilla-León. These three photos tend confirm the information from the topo
map and appear consistent and indicate that the tripoint is approximately
where the track starts to turn towards the south on the right of the pictures.
Once more it appears that the actual borders are a lot more "wiggly" than
shown on the topo maps. So, again, another visit is called for here.
Continuing on south on 2006-05-14
while driving from the north coast of Spain to Madrid. I again went to where I now
expected to find the real tripoint and, indeed, there was a marker there. Some
photos now follow.
|
Again the marker was easily found - interestingly it had
exactly the same inscription on it as the one I found at the more northerly
tripoint. I cannot at this time explain the meaning of this inscription. |
|
A view of the marker looking back towards the road where the
marker found in the previous visit was found. |
|
Other faces of the marker. |
|
For completeness, the last face of the marker. |
|
Again the "money shot" - another Class "A" find. |
|
Looking south along the Castilla-León, Aragón border you can
see two other markers showing this border. The railway line is to the left
of the markers from this vantage point. |
|
These two markers are along the La Rioja, Castilla-León
border. Although it is not evident from the photo, to the best of my ability
(by standing and looking in each direction with binoculars,) I was able to
confirm that these two markers do for a straight line with both the roadside
marker and the tripoint marker pictured earlier, confirming my supposition
that I had, indeed, found the tripoint marker. |
|
Lining up these two La Rioja, Castilla-León markers shows
where the tripoint marker is located with respect to the railway line. |
I hope you have found this interesting - I won't publish my e-mail address
here otherwise I will get spammed to heck but if this is of interest to you, you
could join the Yahoo
Group "boundarypoint" which exists for people with this rather
esoteric tripointing
interest and where you will find the means to e-mail me.